FWWM The Missing Pieces

[AXX°N N.]

There's a level of "you must be insane" incredulity here aimed at what seems like a good faith, ultimately benign belief that some degree of image manipulation may be involved in a film where David Bowie is transported with what are clearly not '90's FX.

The comparisons to the Inland Empire smile strike me as silly--not in that it was used as a touchstone, but to use it to discredit that anything was done to Laura's smile. Yes, they obviously don't resemble each other. But to say that means anything is like saying "clearly Lynch used an actual Frogmoth, because it looks so much more realistic than Diane orb-ifying."

I feel like Dom's suggestion of interpolation (which seems to have been kind of ignored?) attests to the idea that there are various kinds of image manipulation. Whatever effect is there is obviously subtle--no side is saying otherwise.

As for me, I'm still on the fence. I'm finding it less and less believable that the eye stillness could be achieved without some kind of manipulation. Even over the course of what appears to be a short moment, I just don't think eyelid flare can be controlled that intently. It doesn't seem like human focus--it's otherworldly.

 

[David Locke]

Fascinating discussion. I'm far from an expert on this, and had to watch the clip to refresh my memory as I haven't seen TMP in years. But my impression always was that there was some sort of digital manipulation going on. I feel like LostInTheMovies said as much a while back, and I somehow thought there was some sort of consensus that this was true. I also took it as the truth because the shot really does look uncanny in a way that suggests Lynch tweaking it digitally in some way. But I'm not wedded to any one hypothesis... there's just something about it that very much reminds me of some of Lynch's digital FX work going back to DL.com or Inland Empire. Always thought Laura's face looks oddly plastic/doll-like in that shot which only adds to the uncanniness.

 

[Mr. Reindeer]

If we ever do learn the truth, and it turns out that those of us on the side of believing there is some form of digital manipulation turn out to be proven correct—it’s a testament to the artistry that NONE of us are truly certain, even when some of us are PRETTY sure. And, likewise, if it ever comes to light that the shot was accomplished purely in camera…it’s a testament to Lynch’s accomplishment that he got it to look so weird that many of us, who have very good eyes for this kind of thing, mis-identified it. One way or the other, the debate itself is a tribute to the subtlety of Lynch’s filmmaking. It’s difficult to think of another shot in another filmmaker’s work that could inspire so much uncertainty about whether or not it was accomplished with digital aids.

 

[Jordan Cole]

Parts of the image are moving while other parts aren’t.

But that isn't true. Her entire face is moving, but it's in slow motion, and she's staying very still. Lynch obviously instructed her to have a possessed smile but keep her eyes focused and intense. Then he probably shot it at a high frame rate. That's it. I'm truly confused how you think this (notice how her cheeks, her nose, and everything is affected by her smile?)



Looks like this:



It is not a still image. Your eyes can immediately tell a still image from a moving one. You know how in an old movie, or a cheap movie, it will sometimes use a still image? Like even a short of the desert totally still, when the movie uses a still image you can actually tell. And it usually looks kind of terrible and cheesy.

This is literally filmed footage of Sheryl Lee smiling.

 

[Jordan Cole]

Fascinating discussion. I'm far from an expert on this, and had to watch the clip to refresh my memory as I haven't seen TMP in years. But my impression always was that there was some sort of digital manipulation going on. I feel like LostInTheMovies said as much a while back, and I somehow thought there was some sort of consensus that this was true. I also took it as the truth because the shot really does look uncanny in a way that suggests Lynch tweaking it digitally in some way. But I'm not wedded to any one hypothesis... there's just something about it that very much reminds me of some of Lynch's digital FX work going back to DL.com or Inland Empire.

I am truly in the Twilight Zone. Nothing about it looks uncanny to me (scary, yes, but not "impossible" in any way.) It's filmed footage of a woman doing a creepy smile. It looks totally normal. I can literally film myself doing the same sort of thing (dare I?) I mean, other horror movies have had scary smiles too. None as scary as that shot, but nothing about it looks impossible to achieve in reality.

I also don't understand the point others have made that this doesn't seem like Lynch would have thought of it at that time...? Why not? There's not really any basis for that. It seems entirely plausible to me based on the story of the film that he would have thought to put a shot of Laura smiling at the ceiling fan. I mean he tried to have a severed pigs head in the movie.

I am seriously confused that so many can think that shot looks like his 2000s digital FX work, which is totally flat and cartoony and cheap looking. It's just Sheryl Lee in front of a camera! Again, others have pointed this out, but you do see subtle movement throughout her face there. She's just being really, really still, and I assume the shot is in very slow motion. She could have only done that for like 5 seconds!

The only thing that may seem digital to me is some of the light flashes.

EDIT: And now Sabrina has said on reddit no CGI or fx were used in The Missing Pieces. Will that settle things? There is the shot of Bowie disappearing from Argentina that looks like it was done digitally of course.

 

[WorldFarAway]

Ha, can’t believe she actually answered my question. Seems you were right. All I can say in response to your last message is that it looked artificial to me. There’s nothing I can say in my defence that I haven’t already said.

 

[Mr. Reindeer]

Ha, can’t believe she actually answered my question. Seems you were right. All I can say in response to your last message is that it looked artificial to me. There’s nothing I can say in my defence that I haven’t already said.

Same! I can admit when I’m wrong. Glad she clarified and put this to bed (although as Jordan notes, it seems like she may not be entirely correct, given the Bowie shot). Do you have a link to her reply?

 

[1989]

Couldn’t agree more with you Jordan, and I’d be happy to be ‘one of those that thought there was no FX involved in that shot’ if this is ever proven one way or the other.

Sheryl Lee 100% acts that shot/scene. There are various lights and strobes overhead (that Lynch used throughout FWWM). She’s staring straight at a lamp, which you can see reflected in her eyes. Practically anyone could do/have done this—but best to get a world class actor if you want it done quickly/well.

Nothing about it needs CG, FX, manipulation.

But most certainly this was filmed in camera at 48fps, and slowed to half speed at 24fps (or the equivalent, meaning interpolation might have been used to slow down instead).

Just watch this at 2x and it is clear that is how Sheryl Lee was shot. It looks 100% like someone smiling as slow as possible.

Like I said before her whole face lights up when you scrub the vid back and forth..

Cheers

Edit: This was written/sent before reading the above posts.

 

[Jordan Cole]

Just watch this at 2x and it is clear that is how Sheryl Lee was shot. It looks 100% like someone smiling as slow as possible.

I just tried this. I encourage everybody to.

You see how her whole faces moves from this. You see that just under her eyes have a change as her smile gets wider. You can see her cheeks raising. Just look at these three stills from the shot, look how under her eyes go from relaxed, to strained, to more intensely strained. It's literally not a still photo.








Not only that, but her eyelids widen as they get more intense. The shot starts out and she has a slightly sleepy, hypnotized look. As it ends you can see her full green eyes. See?

Also: look at the right side of her face, the side that is out of focus. Look at the shape. Her smile makes her cheeks wider, and this is reflected in her head shape. Because...she's really smiling in front of a film camera!

You could also see her nose/nostrils adjusting to the smile too in these shots.

I'm sure I can point out another dozen things, because so many things move on your face when you smile. It's all there, but intensely restrained by Lee as per Lynch's direction. Again, you'll see this type of creepy smile in lots of horror movies. It's where you try not to make the smile affect under your eyes, which is a huge part of how a smile looks to us. If you try to keep your eyes wide as you smile, it looks insane. It's not natural, but it's certainly physically possible.

WorldFarAway: if these were overlapping images, why go through the extra effort of finding overlapping separate images of Lee's eyes and cheeks and nose appropriately reacting to a smile on her face? Why not simply just film her face? Where are you suggesting the overlapping line is on her face? Because the only thing that doesn't seem to move much is her hair.

 

[WorldFarAway]

I’ve already said that from Sabrina’s comment you appear to be correct. The shot looks how it looks to me - I honestly don’t know what else I can say.

 

[AXX°N N.]

Jordan, no one was saying that Laura's smile and the Inland Empire one looked the exact same. The entire basis of this disagreement is that the would-be effect is subtle. Not good internet form to present someone's argument for them only to make it look wrong.

Sabrina just clarified further: "The Missing Pieces took already edited scenes that had been deleted from the final original film and just scanned them. If there was any VFX, it was done when the film was made and not in 2013 or whenever the Missing Pieces was put together. There is no CGI work. I believe this smile from Sheryl Lee is hers alone - nothing added digitally as far as I know."

So ... not 100% sure this puts anything to bed.

 

[Mr. Reindeer]

Jordan, no one was saying that Laura's smile and the Inland Empire one looked the exact same. The entire basis of this disagreement is that the would-be effect is subtle. Not good internet form to present someone's argument for them only to make it look wrong.

Sabrina just clarified further: "The Missing Pieces took already edited scenes that had been deleted from the final original film and just scanned them. If there was any VFX, it was done when the film was made and not in 2013 or whenever the Missing Pieces was put together. There is no CGI work. I believe this smile from Sheryl Lee is hers alone - nothing added digitally as far as I know."

So ... not 100% sure this puts anything to bed.

It’s probably the best answer we’re ever gonna get, and she seems pretty certain, so I’ll take it. But in true TP fashion, no definitive resolution.

FWIW, I think the Jeffries CGI could easily have been done in the early 1990s.

 

[AXX°N N.]

I'm actually happier, I think, to let the scene retain some degree of production inscrutability.

Either way this thread has been shocking, because I always assumed (and perceived it to be common knowledge) that the Jeffries effect was newly added. I guess some of that is the assumption that, being deleted scenes, there were naturally some unfinished elements. I guess this emphasizes how full and polished these scenes really were compared to the norm, even within Lynch's oeuvre.

 

[Mr. Reindeer]

I'm actually happier, I think, to let the scene retain some degree of production inscrutability.

Either way this thread has been shocking, because I always assumed (and perceived it to be common knowledge) that the Jeffries effect was newly added. I guess some of that is the assumption that, being deleted scenes, there were naturally some unfinished elements. I guess this emphasizes how full and polished these scenes really were compared to the norm, even within Lynch's oeuvre.

Well, just to throw one further wrinkle onto Sabrina’s answer, TMP does feature a credit for “special visual effects” by David Lynch and Noriko Miyakawa. Miyakawa didn’t meet Lynch until 2005, per Room to Dream, so there was definitely SOME new VFX work done for the Missing Pieces edit.

 

[WorldFarAway]

Well, just to throw one further wrinkle onto Sabrina’s answer, TMP does feature a credit for “special visual effects” by David Lynch and Noriko Miyakawa. Miyakawa didn’t meet Lynch until 2005, per Room to Dream, so there was definitely SOME new VFX work done for the Missing Pieces edit.

I have asked Sabrina about this but feel I may be pushing my luck! Will definitely stop pestering her after this.

 

[Mr. Reindeer]

I have asked Sabrina about this but feel I may be pushing my luck! Will definitely stop pestering her after this.

Yeah, I’m surprised she’s indulged us this far! She’s usually a one and done answer kinda lady, I feel like. Thanks for taking one for the team! (And thanks to Sabrina, if you ever happen to read this!)

 

[Jasper]

Sabrina just posted:

You now what, I’m going to have to take back what I said. There were a few scenes that were edited or re-edited and VFX were applied to them. You are correct. I totally forgot. Sorry about that! As for her smile, though, that is as it was.

 

[Mr. Reindeer]

Well, that puts it to bed (again!). BTW, WorldFarAway, Noriko is a she, not a he.

 

[AXX°N N.]

Smile no VFX, Bowie yes VFX, damn, after all that ... I'm back to my initial presumptions!

 

[Mr. Reindeer]

Smile no VFX, Bowie yes VFX, damn, after all that ... I'm back to my initial presumptions!

And all of this should have remained in the “Season 4” thread, because we’ve now conclusively proved that if Sabrina is so bored that she’ll answer all our questions in detail, there clearly is no filming going on currently.