Better Call Saul - the final stretch
- Thread starter Jasper
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- Apr 11, 2022
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Cappy
White Lodge
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Welcome to the forum
Haven't seen it. Now I know what I'm watching tomorrow!
Enjoy it! Its a great film. I saw it for the first time just this past summer.
- Apr 12, 2022
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Only two episodes left, each directed by one of the two big guys.
S6E12 - “Waterworks” directed by Vince Gilligan
S6E13 - “Saul Gone” directed by Peter Gould
Episode 11 left things be very tense, and these are pretty provocative titles. Waterworks is common slang for crying. Saul Gone we can presumably translate as either “Saul is gone” or “It’s all gone,” or both.
Any predictions? Will we see Kim again? What happened during Gene’s phone call to Florida when he flipped out? Did he find out Kim wasn’t there anymore and they didn’t have any new contact information? If she’s not there, is she in Nebraska?
S6E12 - “Waterworks” directed by Vince Gilligan
S6E13 - “Saul Gone” directed by Peter Gould
Episode 11 left things be very tense, and these are pretty provocative titles. Waterworks is common slang for crying. Saul Gone we can presumably translate as either “Saul is gone” or “It’s all gone,” or both.
Any predictions? Will we see Kim again? What happened during Gene’s phone call to Florida when he flipped out? Did he find out Kim wasn’t there anymore and they didn’t have any new contact information? If she’s not there, is she in Nebraska?
Mr. Reindeer
White Lodge
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Waterworks can also refer to the sprinkler company where Kim supposedly now works in Florida.
“Saul Gone” is an appropriately cheeky title, along the punny lines of BB’s finale being an anagram of “finale” in addition to referring to the subject of the song that opens the episode. It also of course calls back to the pun “‘s’all good man” which gave him his name (which I think was actually an intentional reference to a character of the same name in the brilliantly trippy ‘Illuminatus Trilogy’ by Robert Shea and Robert Anton Wilson, if you want to get really pedantic!).
“Saul Gone” is an appropriately cheeky title, along the punny lines of BB’s finale being an anagram of “finale” in addition to referring to the subject of the song that opens the episode. It also of course calls back to the pun “‘s’all good man” which gave him his name (which I think was actually an intentional reference to a character of the same name in the brilliantly trippy ‘Illuminatus Trilogy’ by Robert Shea and Robert Anton Wilson, if you want to get really pedantic!).
- Apr 12, 2022
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- #46
The implications of this, to quote Ben Horne, “could be extensive, could be far reaching . . . far reaching.”
Mr. Reindeer
White Lodge
- Apr 13, 2022
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Wow. My stomach was in a knot for that entire episode. I think the thing I’ll miss most about this team and this universe is how expert they are at building and sustaining suspense. This last mini-arc is almost playing like its own self-contained movie, like Saul’s version of El Camino (albeit a much darker story).
I thought it couldn’t get more surreal and heartbreaking than seeing Kim in the cathedral of justice. But then we get her smoking a cigarette alone outside that strip mall office, calling back to happier times in season 1 with her and Jimmy in the HHM parking garage...and then, that familiar, “HEYO!” Worlds colliding.
Lots of people on reddit predicted that Marion would catch on to “Gene” (Chekhov's laptop), but I love how simple and elegant the reveal was. “Albuquerque. Conman.” You can just see how much it kills Jimmy/Saul/Gene to have his whole life reduced to those two words. Chuck’s prophecy fulfilled.
And even in that suspenseful moment, this show can make me laugh. Because of course Marion was using Ask Jeeves in 2010.
Do we think Jimmy would have actually strangled Marion in that moment? I have to say, that might be the most disturbing moment in the entire Breaking Bad extended universe, because we’ve gotten to know Jimmy so well, and for all his flaws he’s never been a violent guy before.
Other little moments I loved: the ticket booth at the courthouse is now automated (if Mike had stuck to the straight and narrow, he’d have been out of work). Jimmy’s Blondie singalong in the car, jumping the gun on the chorus. Again, even in the heat of hugely suspenseful episodes, this show is brilliant at inserting humorous human moments.
I thought it couldn’t get more surreal and heartbreaking than seeing Kim in the cathedral of justice. But then we get her smoking a cigarette alone outside that strip mall office, calling back to happier times in season 1 with her and Jimmy in the HHM parking garage...and then, that familiar, “HEYO!” Worlds colliding.
Lots of people on reddit predicted that Marion would catch on to “Gene” (Chekhov's laptop), but I love how simple and elegant the reveal was. “Albuquerque. Conman.” You can just see how much it kills Jimmy/Saul/Gene to have his whole life reduced to those two words. Chuck’s prophecy fulfilled.
And even in that suspenseful moment, this show can make me laugh. Because of course Marion was using Ask Jeeves in 2010.
Do we think Jimmy would have actually strangled Marion in that moment? I have to say, that might be the most disturbing moment in the entire Breaking Bad extended universe, because we’ve gotten to know Jimmy so well, and for all his flaws he’s never been a violent guy before.
Other little moments I loved: the ticket booth at the courthouse is now automated (if Mike had stuck to the straight and narrow, he’d have been out of work). Jimmy’s Blondie singalong in the car, jumping the gun on the chorus. Again, even in the heat of hugely suspenseful episodes, this show is brilliant at inserting humorous human moments.
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krishnanspace
Glastonbury Grove
- Apr 13, 2022
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Amazing episode. I had a feeling that Marion would call the cops. Wonder if Lynch has been watching better call Saul. I remember him saying that he is a fan of breaking bad
Mr. Reindeer
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I got the sense that he binged Breaking Bad and Mad Men after they ended. I don’t know if he’s much of a weekly watcher.
- Apr 12, 2022
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I'm not quite sure what Jimmy would have done. I kind of think he wouldn't have, but on the other hand, he is really going off the rails. There was also the moment when he was going to smash the guy’s head with the urn, and the face he made as he was about to do it.
Jimmy also couldn’t connect with Kim on a human level in the phone call. He was more in Saul mode, and behaving in an aggressive, aloof, and entitled manner. I think that we, as the audience, are primed to want there to be an emotional re-connection in the scene, but Jimmy isn't capable of it, and perhaps some of that is his emotional armor. If he hadn’t acted like that, Kim might not have snapped and filed the affidavit. Not that she shouldn’t have. She did the right thing.
Jimmy singing The Tide is High is both funny and off-putting, because as ridiculous as it is, we know that he’s whistling past the graveyard. He’s gotten sloppy and seemingly self-destructive, and whatever little moral shred that he had remaining, even as Saul Goodman, appears to be slipping away. I think that was the double meaning in the previous episode’s title, Breaking Bad. Jimmy’s already bad, of course, but steamrolling his own little glimmer of humanity and deciding to keep pursuing his crew’s final mark, even after one third of the crew leaves out of conscientious objection, is something of a new low.
We see a display of regret and hurt from Jimmy when Marion says, “I trusted you.” There’s a tiny little kernel of actual affection in Jimmy’s otherwise false and manipulative presentation. Somewhere in there I think that a part of him actually does like Marion, similarly to how he had real affection for the old woman who he discovered was being ripped off by Sandpiper. Carol Burnett’s acting has been very good, but it was truly excellent in that closing scene. I didn’t expect that in 2022 I’d be watching Carol Burnett in something, let alone talking about her great dramatic acting turn. She deserves some kind of award for a guest role in a television series. It was brilliant casting.
I’ve loved the entire time jump after Kim left Jimmy. It’s a very fresh and unusual way to end a series, and it does indeed feel a lot like its own thing.
Mr. Reindeer
White Lodge
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Both of the Jimmy/Kim scenes in this episode were brutal. Great point that he’s become even more inhuman in the Gene timeline than he was as Saul in Breaking Bad...although he is pretty fucking awful to Kim in the Saul-era scene. Him asking why she chose Florida, then cutting her off dismissively as soon as she opens her mouth (“doesn’t matter, it doesn’t have to make sense”) was so cold and mean. I loved that they had him call Francesca “sweet cheeks.” Not only leaning directly into the sleazy Breaking Bad persona, but having him do it in front of Kim to twist the knife out of pure spite.
Subtle detail, but the phone call was on Jimmy’s fiftieth birthday (it was previously established that the phone call with Francesca is November 12, and that he was born on November 12, 1960). Making it all the more poignant when Kim has to go sing happy birthday to her coworker immediately afterward. (And of course, the fiftieth birthday has tremendous resonance in the Breaking Bad universe, since that show began on Walt’s fiftieth.)
Jimmy telling Kim he’s “still out here, still getting away with it” reminds me of what Vince Gilligan said during Breaking Bad: that Saul was the one character he promised would not be killed off because he’s a cockroach who always survives. At the time, that was a cute idea. Now, it’s pathetic and tragic, and on some level it almost seems like Jimmy is begging to be put out of his misery.
What’s incredible is that Jimmy is actually the one who tells Kim to turn herself in. Granted, he says it to be shitty after she suggests that HE should turn himself in, but in hearing it turned on her, she realizes that he is right that she needs to take responsibility as well. He plants the seed that leads her to confess.
Subtle detail, but the phone call was on Jimmy’s fiftieth birthday (it was previously established that the phone call with Francesca is November 12, and that he was born on November 12, 1960). Making it all the more poignant when Kim has to go sing happy birthday to her coworker immediately afterward. (And of course, the fiftieth birthday has tremendous resonance in the Breaking Bad universe, since that show began on Walt’s fiftieth.)
Jimmy telling Kim he’s “still out here, still getting away with it” reminds me of what Vince Gilligan said during Breaking Bad: that Saul was the one character he promised would not be killed off because he’s a cockroach who always survives. At the time, that was a cute idea. Now, it’s pathetic and tragic, and on some level it almost seems like Jimmy is begging to be put out of his misery.
What’s incredible is that Jimmy is actually the one who tells Kim to turn herself in. Granted, he says it to be shitty after she suggests that HE should turn himself in, but in hearing it turned on her, she realizes that he is right that she needs to take responsibility as well. He plants the seed that leads her to confess.
Mr. Reindeer
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As a random aside, it occurred to me that Rhea Seehorn is only seven years older than Aaron Paul. Obviously, we’ve done a lot of suspending disbelief with characters’ appearances on BCS, but that scene of the two of them together clearly very close in age appearance-wise, despite the fact that Jesse is 19 at that point in the timeline (!), is really pushing it. (Don’t get me wrong, I loved the scene and I’m so glad it happened. It also felt like Paul was much more “on” in this scene than the last episode, especially voice wise; not sure why, maybe it was Gilligan directing?)
One more random thought: Was Combo stealing baby Jesus from a nativity scene a deep reference to The Leftovers (where a first season episode revolved around this premise)? Seemed like such a random throwaway line, and immediately made me think of that show.
One more random thought: Was Combo stealing baby Jesus from a nativity scene a deep reference to The Leftovers (where a first season episode revolved around this premise)? Seemed like such a random throwaway line, and immediately made me think of that show.
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- Apr 12, 2022
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- #55
I didn't know about the fiftieth birthday thing. Interesting. In that phone call, Jimmy not only cheats himself of any emotional re-connection, he cheats us of experiencing that catharsis. He's even cheating us now! We'll see how much he can get away with, now that there will be a regional, if not national APB out for his arrest, and he'll truly be a man on the run, this time not with a mere changed identity, but like a desperate wild animal. Lalo even told Kim that Jimmy would be fine when he went missing, because, "he's like the [makes scurrying motion with hand] cucaracha, a born survivor." This is true, but even a cockroach isn't invincible.
Aaron Paul definitely looked like a grown man in his scene, but his acting was on point, and it was a good scene, and well filmed. Two flawed individuals who each ended up paired with an even more flawed individual, leading them to ruin. Still, as it stands now, they end up better off than most of the other major characters in that universe.
The slowness of the production of each season has been frustrating, and even more so given the obvious fact that the characters who also appear in BB are supposed to be younger than they are in that show. That said, there's something nice about the way that they simply trust in the actors to convey their scripted identities, almost more like theater, where more extensive suspension of disbelief with regards the actors and their characters is a bit more par for the course. It's also interesting that we're in a time of rapid technological innovation in terms of de-aging actors, or even recreating actors who've already passed on. We can assume that these processes will get better, easier, and cheaper, and thus much more common, just like the new method of filming in round LED sound stages. I assume there will also be more digital tweaking of performances, changing of vocal expression, facial expression, body language and things of that nature. Even changes of facial structure, hair, makeup, and costume. I don't particularly like that, but it seems somewhat inevitable. Prosthesis isnt new, and fashion photographs have been radically altered for ages, even pre-digital.
Mr. Reindeer
White Lodge
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I appreciate your comparison to theater, and I likewise love how the show makes no effort to de-age the characters even though they certainly could afford to. There’s something really refreshing about just letting the performances be au naturel.
So, here’s my million dollar question going into the finale. We know we have one more Cranston scene to come. In the most recent episode, we got one of the unlikeliest comebacks of all, with Emilio Koyama (14 years after we last saw him on Breaking Bad!). But, the most important question in terms of deceased characters...are we going to see Chuck one last time? Whether it’s a flashback or a dream or a vision or whatever, he’s been such an important part of the arc of this show and Jimmy’s character that I really suspect he’ll play some role in the finale.
So, here’s my million dollar question going into the finale. We know we have one more Cranston scene to come. In the most recent episode, we got one of the unlikeliest comebacks of all, with Emilio Koyama (14 years after we last saw him on Breaking Bad!). But, the most important question in terms of deceased characters...are we going to see Chuck one last time? Whether it’s a flashback or a dream or a vision or whatever, he’s been such an important part of the arc of this show and Jimmy’s character that I really suspect he’ll play some role in the finale.
Mr. Reindeer
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No, I think it was years earlier. The Jimmy/Kim breakup following Howard’s death happens in 2004, whereas Breaking Bad begins in 2008. Presumably the divorce proceedings happen around 2004 or so shortly after the breakup.
- Apr 12, 2022
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I have no idea if Chuck will return. I hadn't really considered it, although a carefully placed appearance by Chuck could serve to underline the completeness of Jimmy's failure as a human, for both the audience and for Jimmy himself, although I'm not sure that such a thing is needed. We can see more clearly than ever that Chuck was even more right about Jimmy than we knew, although I think that we should acknowledge the possibility that Chuck's distrust of Jimmy negatively impacted him, and potentially made his behavior even worse.
Perhaps Jimmy dies in a shootout with law enforcement, only to find himself standing before the pearly gates. To his pleasant surprise, he's about to be admitted, when a winged and haloed Chuck comes rushing out of the puffy clouds shouting, "No! No! You can't let him in here! He's impure! He'll ruin everything! He'll make a complete mockery of all of the heavenly principles that we hold dear!"
Agent Earle
Great Northern Hotel
- Apr 12, 2022
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Guys, not to intrude on your discussion, just wanted to say, I've started to watch Better Call Saul over the summer and am now an episode away from the Season 2 finale (the one I watched last had Chuck having a seizure at the print shop and hitting his head)- I've held off this long, even as I read very positive things about it, because I wanted to have the whole thing out in its entirety so I can now watch it at my own leisure, without year- or more-long waits between the seasons (this is my favourite way of watching TV shows - I don't binge as such, I usually watch 1-3 episodes a week, so it takes me about half a year to get through a show), and I'm ABSOLUTELY LOVING it! It's already a candidate for my Top 10 list of shows and I'm not even halfway through. Everything about it appeals to me, the acting, the story, the psychology that grounds the characters, the visuals... I may even have a stronger response to it than with Breaking Bad, though I suspect the trajectory the two main characters complete with their story arcs is pretty similar, if not the same. Anyway, I'm gonna buzz off now, as I don't want to read about any spoilers (I avoided reading what you wrote about it above); here's hoping the series' conclusion left you satisfied (even if you feel sad and hurt with how - some of the - things turned out, like we so often do with the post-Sopranos television) and looking forward to the journey that still awaits me!
